PrintGrilled: Daniel Zemans, Chicago Correspondent
Note: Today we're interviewing Daniel Zemans, our new Chicago burger correspondent! He's admittedly more of a pizza aficionado than a burger lover, but with "AHT reviewer" recently added to his lists of skills, methinks his burger love will flourish. (Besides, he's an overall "food lover," which is perfect for the Serious Eats community.) If you missed them, check out his reviews on Kuma's Corner and Erwin.
Burgers, pizza, and...sometimes babies
[Photograph: Daniel Zemans]
Name: Daniel Zemans
Location: Chicago
Occupation: Technically a lawyer, but I do it as little as possible.
How often do you eat burgers? Not as much as I should. I tend to go on burger binges. Writing for AHT will cure my burger eating disorder.
Where did you eat your most recent one? David Burke's Primehouse (review forthcoming on AHT).
Cheese: American, cheddar, other? When offered, blue; otherwise, usually cheddar. When American is the only option, I am definitely not disappointed.
Ketchup or mustard? Mustard, preferably yellow but brown is fine too. I'm not going to tell anyone not to put ketchup on their burger. I will judge them, possibly out loud and in a condescending manner, but I will not tell them not to do it.
Sesame-seed or plain? Sesame-seed.
Grilled, griddled, or broiled? Grilled.
And how would you like that done? Rare. I don't like ketchup, but I can understand that some people like corn syrup and tomato paste on their burgers. I cannot understand why people get their burgers cooked more than medium rare. I just don't get the thought process that would lead someone to ask that their food have so much of its flavor cooked out of it. Maybe there's significant overlap between people who get burgers cooked medium to well and those who really like ketchup and they don't want anything getting in the way of their beloved condiment?
Would you do us the favor of describing your perfect burger? I'm a simple man. Just give me 8 ounces of coarsely ground meat, cooked so it's red on the inside, but warm, top it with some aged blue cheese, mustard and grilled onions, and put that juicy sucker on a bun that won't disintegrate and I'll be happy.
The hamburger is a food item with which most Americans have strong childhood associations. Do you remember your earliest encounter with this delicious dish? I'm sure it wasn't my first encounter, but my strongest early burger memories took place at Jimmy's (known to outsiders as Woodlawn Tap). It's a bar in the neighborhood of my youth that I periodically visited with my father.
What's your favorite fast-food burger? White Castle. I cut out most fast food about nine years ago and haven't been to McDonald's, Burger King, or Wendy's since. I do visit local fast food places when traveling, but I crave none of them like I do the occasional White Castle slider.
What topping or condiment, in your opinion, should never grace a burger? Other than ketchup, I don't think I've ever seen anything added to a burger that has really turned me off. You didn't ask about buns, but I will also throw out there that I have never had a burger served on a brioche where I didn't wish for a different kind of bun.
What's the most unusual burger you've ever eaten? I can't single out one, but the collection of burgers at Kuma's Corner is like nothing I've seen elsewhere.
What's the most overrated burger you've tried? Most underrated? Most overrated is absolutely the Billy Goat Tavern, which is pretty much crap. I may eventually review it for AHT just so I can give a detailed report about not just how bad their burger is, but how absurd their schtick has become.
What are your top five burgers in Chicago? David Burke's Primehouse, Kuma's Corner, Rosebud Steakhouse, Select Cut Steakhouse and Hackney's (extra points for the onion brick).
For some crazy reason, you're going vegetarian. Where do you go for your final burger? McDonald's, because if I'm cutting out meat, the importance of taste has clearly been superseded by other food issues. And if that happens, I don't deserve a good burger.
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25 Comments:
No brioche? No ketchup? The man is clearly a genius (although the inclusion of blue cheese might make him insane)
In all seriousness welcome to AHT Daniel. I have been enjoying your work at Slice and AHT will be a better place with you here.
Nick Solares at 12:32PM on 09/04/09
Wait a minute.. Someone who likes burgers with blue cheese, mustard, and onions is talking smack about people who enjoy their burgers fully cooked?
Heh.
ratbuddy at 12:49PM on 09/04/09
It's just quite possible, that, with the mad cow disease (bovine spongiform encephalopathy) scare of a few years ago (did it really go away?), that some people, myself and my genius friend included, decided that it was better to give away a bit of flavor rather than risk dying a horrible death, other than abstaining from burgers altogether. If you recall, our Government was taking absolutely no steps to prevent the spread of MCD to the US. So, we didn't know what the probabilities were. I've gradually moved back to medium doneness.
Summerfield at 12:54PM on 09/04/09
"I just don't get the thought process that would lead someone to ask that their food have so much of its flavor cooked out of it."
... yet you will completely obscure and overwhelm all other flavors with blue cheese.
very questionable.
I like your pizza reviews though.
intheyearofthepig at 2:39PM on 09/04/09
Rare??? Totally disgusting! Why not just eat a chunk of raw ground beef-it's essentially the same thing!
jlew911 at 3:29PM on 09/04/09
@jlew911: Not sure if I'm the only person here who likes steak tartare and yukhoe but...those are two tasty cold dishes made of raw beef. Pretty different from a rare burger though.
Robyn Lee at 3:38PM on 09/04/09
Rare, blue cheese, and those are your top five burger places in Chicago. No wonder you don't like Billy Goat, burger snob.
jjchampion at 4:42PM on 09/04/09
@jjchampion Burger snob? Dude likes White Castle! You've gone up in my book Daniel.
Nick Kindelsperger at 5:24PM on 09/04/09
Uh, wait a minute.
Welcome to AHT, but he's apparently decided to forego meat for some unspecified (there's always hope!) time. Sort of makes hamburgers and probably most pizzas off the menu, huh?
Guess we won't be reading as much of Daniel as we used to.
Sov at 9:30PM on 09/04/09
Who knew my love of blue cheese would cause controversy? It is, admittedly, a very strong flavor. I've typically found that the places that offer it are ones that offer particularly large burgers of better quality meat - burgers that can stand up to the cheese.
@Nick Solares: Thanks! Hope I can live up to your expectations.
@Summerfield: I can definitely understand the fear, especially since the media jumps all over every story of tainted ground beef. I guess I just have confidence in most restaurateurs fear of litigation to think they're going to take proper precautions with their beef. Hopefully, I don't learn a painful lesson any time soon.
@jjchampion: As Pauper Nick pointed out, I have to think my White Castle love protects me from claims of snobbery. I also don't understand why liking a rare burger is indicative of being a burger snob.
@Sov: Where did you gt the idea I've decided to give up meat?
Daniel Zemans at 2:15PM on 09/05/09
Well Daniel, I can say that you're a snob as to dissing people who like their burger cooked past medium, and wondering why people like ketchup. You sound like a huge snob in that factor. Blue Cheese and Mustard? Sounds kinda...wrong?
@Sov: the person who asked the question obviously did not ask it properly. He was asking IF he went vegetarian, where would he would eat his last burger.
carmen89 at 2:47PM on 09/05/09
As far as doneness goes, for me at least, food safety is a non issue. I just prefer the taste and texture of a properly (fully) cooked burger.
ratbuddy at 10:23AM on 09/06/09
Daniel, it's the tone of your answers.
You love White Castle? That's fine. But then you add that you cut out fast food nine years ago, and later dis McDonald's (yawn). It smacks of snobbery, like when people proclaim "I don't even own a TV" before ranting about the quality of television programming.
You like your burgers rare and without ketchup? Fine, good for you. But then, as carmen89 mentioned, you proceed to mock those whose opinions and preferences differ from yours.
Whatever. I know these "Grilled" features aren't particularly serious, and I imagine that some of your answers were tongue in cheek or meant to be flippant, but it read as burger snobbery to me.
jjchampion at 2:20PM on 09/06/09
gosh burger sluts are every bit as offensive as burger snobs.
twoshoes at 3:17PM on 09/06/09
I honestly didn't read Daniel's answers as snobby when I read them, but I think that's because I've actually met him and he's one of the least snobby, nicest, and easy to talk to people I've ever met. I'm glad to have him on the AHT team.
If not liking McD burgers = snobbery, then I was a burger snob since I was born. I never liked their burgers..BUT I LOVE ME SOME CHICKEN NUGGETS. And like Daniel, I cut out most most fast food nine years ago too. :\
Robyn Lee at 6:29PM on 09/06/09
Daniel,
Do you by any chance put ketchup on a hot dog? I don't think it goes well on a hot dog and tends to mask it's flavor. For that I'm called a hot dog snob. Which is pretty funny since to me that sounds like an oxymoron. Personally I don't care if someone puts dog poop on their hot dog. It probably goes better than ketchup. But some people act as though I'm trying to outlaw it. It seems that a lot people who prefer ketchup as their condiment of choice on a hot dog have a hard time with those who express the opinon that it doesn't belong.
hotdoglover at 7:50PM on 09/06/09
Hotdoglover, it's really just a matter of taste. Some people (not me, but whatever) actually like ketchup on hot dogs. Are they wrong? I don't think so, they just have their own vision of what tastes good. No reason to look down upon them.
ratbuddy at 8:08PM on 09/06/09
See, that's what I mean. I don't look down on them. My own son, who is 18, and past the age where most make the transition from ketchup to mustard, still puts ketchup on his hot dog. I finally got him to try mustard. He likes it and puts it on his dogs about 25% of the time. But he still prefers ketchup. While it may not be wrong to enjoy a combination that you like, I still feel ketchup ruins or at least diminishes a quality hot dog.
Some people may dip a great pickle in ice cream. To me it diminishes both. But these people do it. Are they wrong? That's how I view ketchup on a hot dog. But yet I like it on a burger.
hotdoglover at 9:10PM on 09/06/09
Oh great! Another ketchup snob. Enjoy your blue cheese with a bit of beef underneath.
UnasBravas at 9:28AM on 09/07/09
A former post I wrote (tongue in cheek) after being called a hot dog snob:
Proudly I embrace the label "hot dog snob".
I would sooner put ketchup on a steak from Peter Luger's than desecrate a hot dog with that stuff. Ketchup on a hot dog is an abomination. It just is. In fact, our Creator prohibited the stuff on the Holy Frankfurter. It was one of the Lost Commandments that was originally handed down to Moses.
I know that some argue "that's how I eat mine, and who are you to tell me otherwise?" Well, if you want to defile a perfect food, I can't stop you. I just wish that you wouldn't do it in public. It's a shameful act that years ago was only committed in the privacy of one's home. I have to admit that my son used to engage in this behavior. I was shocked and had to question my wife regarding the boy's paternity. Nonetheless he stopped this antisocial behavior when he turned 16. Part of it had to do with the maturing process, while the rest of it was because I had threatened to put him up for adoption. My wife and I spent a lot of time and effort administering some tough love in an attempt to turn my son around. I'm glad things turned out ok.
My daughter (22 and out of the house) never put ketchup on a hot dog. But for some inexplicable reason, she stopped eating meat at the age of 16. But that's another story for another day.
The topic of ketchup on a hot dog has come up frequently on Serious Eats. I am an opinionated person, especially when it comes to hot dogs, beer, religion, and politics. But I have refrained, until recently, from commenting on this subject. Why? you may ask. Because it scares me. I've been reluctant to discuss the issue, but I feel like I can share something personal with my Serious Eats family. According to my regular family, I spend more time on these forums listening to you people than them. Anyway, about two years ago I had the most horrible nightmare I've ever had. Fascists took over the country and the first thing they did was take away the right of law abiding citizens to own guns. Then they decreed that hot dogs must be eaten with ketchup. Michael Hoffman was right! He is a wise man who should be taken seriously. As leader of the opposition, I was arrested. The fascists wanted to make an example of me, so they put me on national television and tried to force feed me a hot dog with ketchup on it.
Just before they were able to pry my mouth open, I woke up in a cold sweat. I was so scared that I jumped in my car and drove to my childhood home. I crawled into bed between my elderly parents and even insisted that my mother go up into the attic and bring down my old teddy bear and security blanket. With the help of a loving family and a good therapist, I have been making progress dealing with my phobia.
This whole ketchup on a hot dog abomination should have been nipped in the bud. Because it wasn't, we are reaping the consequences. Reprobates have opened trendy hot dog restaurants (in New Jersey of all places!) and introduced all kinds of deviations from the traditional hot dog. In addition to ketchup, we now have such things as cream cheese, peanut butter, broccoli rabe, corn flakes, and eggs being thrown at us. And that's just some of the things. The rest I've blocked out, fearing a relapse and a possible return to the psychiatrist's couch. I shudder to think what might be next. The rumor going around in hot dog circles is that two twenty something guys are looking to open their own place soon. Their goal is to outdo the existing hot dog eateries where the focus is the crap piled on the dog rather than the dog itself. Proposed toppings include raisinets, gummy bears, rice crispies, oatmeal, and sweet tarts.
Be afraid. Be very afraid.
hotdoglover at 11:00AM on 09/07/09
@jjchampion: I did mock and it was all in good fun. In reality, I'm in hotdoglover's camp: I don't really care what other people do to their burgers. Or anything else they eat for that matter.
I think my burger reviews will be pretty clear, but I think this Grilled bit is great as it gives readers a chance to know where I'm coming from when I do my reviews. I've disavowed ketchup and brioche buns and declared my love for rare meat and strong cheeses. That's the flavor profile I want in a burger, so when I review a place and say what I like about it, it's great that readers know what I'm looking for so they can decide whether the burger I'm describing is one that they think they'll enjoy.
As for cutting out fast food, my reasons were much more tied to the chemicals that go into it and the treatment of employees by most chains that led me to give up on what had been at least a weekly dining choice. I'm not particularly vigilant when it comes to food politics (see: White Castle intake), but it was a place where I could do a little bit while ensuring a healthier lifestyle, which was important given how much other crap I eat.
@roboppy: You grossly exaggerate, but thanks for the kind words.
@hotdoglover: I do not and would not put ketchup on a hot dog. I love sweets, but I think the processed sweetener in ketchup severely clashes with beef. I actually think ketchup clashes with pretty much anything. The only time I eat ketchup is when I'm eating a quality of french fry that tastes more like oil than potato. In those cases, where the fry is pretty much a vessel for fat, I'll gladly soak the thing in ketchup as sugary fat is even better than regular fat.
@Everyone who equates not liking fast food to being a food snob, I'd love to hear some of you make the case as to the quality of places like McDonald's rather than simply insulting those of us who prefer things like fresh meat in our burgers.
Daniel Zemans at 10:00PM on 09/07/09
Daniel, re-readad your response to "And how would you like that done?"
It really does come off as though you think anyone who likes burgers fully cooked or likes ketchup is some kind of sink peeing mouth breather.
ratbuddy at 3:45PM on 09/08/09
Oops, that's re-read.
And for the record, I really like your work on the Slice side of things.
ratbuddy at 3:46PM on 09/08/09
Amen to the anti-shout out to the Billy Goat!
ShowMeBaseballAlum at 5:22PM on 09/08/09
A good hot dog is worthy of nothing less than good mustard, a steamed soft bun and maybe some sauerkraut. Drag it through the garden if you wish. But ketchup on a dog? That's just heresy.
NotAmerican at 3:11PM on 09/09/09